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"complete waste of money !"

"the resolution on this camera is great and the night vision means i can see what's happening even in total darkness"

"very disappointed"

"my only gripe is that i can't find any software that runs on a mac to view this camera which is a shame"

"the instructors are helpful however the only issue is it never informed me to put sound on my phone to set up wifi and that's the only issue i have had with the device and i will be looking at buying more just as soon as i get a bigger home"

"its a steal for the price ive seen more expensive ones but i dont know how much better you can get than this"

"if you don’t allow location services it says you must activate it in an error message"

"only problem which you might need to be aware"

"if there is one gripe it is that there doesn't seem to be a way of transferring the recordings on the sd card to a pc for more convenient viewing but that is a minor issue and i remain thoroughy impressed"

"on max sensitivity gives false alarms and lower sensitivity is not reliable"

"whilst this isn’t a major problem for a pet monitor there is no way i would trust this as a baby monitor"

"there is an option to use their cloud storage service if you do not have an sd card but wish to save the recordings to view back this is a free trial for 30 days then there is a cost – but it is reasonable and optional"

"the first issue is that the power cable isn’t very long so have needed to buy an extension lead"

"my only negative is after a month it stopped recording unless you subscribe for a fee so now i just use it to check on my dog when i need and to just scroll back if i need to look back at what she has been doing"

"i have had no further issues and i have been thrilled with the purchases"

"we are yet to mount it on the ceiling where we want it as the usb power cable isn't very long so limits where we could place it we will need to get an extender"

"don’t waste your money if you need real time monitoring baby etc "

"i can never understand why videos of cctv in the private sector are of such poor quality when a camera for this price is so good!"

"at first i was a bit apprehensive at its cheap price having had other 100 150 pound cameras which were't too user friendly or reliable"

"there is a slight delay in transmission from the camera to the device but it's only a couple of seconds so once we knew this it was fine"

"the power lead is also very poor quality it is very loose and if you touch it gently it will come out of it's port on the camera so i have to keep are plugging the power lead back in to the camera as it falls out quite often"

"a bit tricky to set up the process doesn't always go smoothly but persevere"

"overall a severe disappointment"

"i'm extremely disappointed"

"all in all an absolute waste of money"

"total waste of money"

"extremely annoying"

"the worst thing is"

"really disappointing product"

"very poor quality slow at reacting and the sound quality is extremely poor"

"not sure why it does this but it's quite frustrating"

"awful just awful"

"my old ip camera was having some problems losing connectivity resetting itself and so on and it was getting really annoying"

"small disappointment due to the impossibility to automatically download a picture or a small clip upon movement"

"purchase with caution"

"not reliable and really annoyed!"

"the camera is fine but people need to know that that it only works with one specific app ipc360 which is complete garbage!"

"3 motion control time periods are very crude too cant set different time periods for different days"

"in short: the camera has pretty shoddy build quality in my case around the microsd card slot"

"we previously used a monitor that connected through her light bulb fitting which had a huge downside to it we couldn't use her main light or it affected the connection to the actual monitor !"

"two days in and manual useless does not show where to insert sd card or which way up"

"i have a good broadband connection and even hard wired it when i thought maybe its just not any good for wireless connection but the picture quality is very poor definitely no where near 1080p and extremely choppy glitchy"

"please don’t get me wrong we are happy customers but if you want proper cctv i wouldn’t bother with these because like us you’ll probably just end up buying better which in the long run wastes money on these cheaper cameras so glad we only bought the one to test it out first"

"i have my elderly mum come stay quite often & she is suffering with dementia"

"i had a motorola camera for our baby its been nothing but a pain since i bought it: continual video dropouts and poor pan zoom"

"also the card they send you saying to review it 5 star and they will send you a brand new camera for free is absolutely nonsense"

"everything worked great for about a week but now the app keeps disconnecting from the camera every few minutes so i have to keep opening the camera back up to see if my baby has woken up rather than it just staying on all the time which is very frustrating"

"i'm tech savvy and can't even connect this junk to the wifi after numerous attempts"

"the insistence on using cloud storage in china is annoying and risky"

"the app also suffered from the fact that their "leave feedback" from is completely broken in that it always fails to send the message and they don't bother replying to messages left on reviews for the app"

"only when i received it did i become aware that you actually have to pay extra for this which was disappointing"

"camera itself works fine but the asian server which the camera app relies on is terribly unreliable keeps resetting and kicking us out of the app and having problems connecting we're pretty sure it's not our internet as other things like video streaming work fine "

"but not blocking issue"

"you do need an sd card to record video so bypassing the costly cloud storage"

"please do not buy because of security and privacy issues!"

"small issue i had was sound in one camera but after reinstalling it this went away"

"but didn’t work when i was out the country due to wifi connectivity issues so not practical for cctv security when abroad"

"i therefore decided to return mine"

"but the app is extremely glitchy and will frequently crash"

"i was planning to but another one for the living room but i won't as the password issue is a big one for me"

"there are many cameras on the market at the moment and i spent days researching all the best selling and reviewed cameras"

"make sure your phone is not on silent mode while monitoring especially babies so you can hear their sound when they wake up"

"clearly chinese rubbish"

"i would hazard a guess it doesnt if there’s no info on it"

"i have changed memory card twice 32 gb and 64 gb and formatted using the icp360 app as recommended so it's not a memory card problem"

"the app is a little clunky and my main criticism is that you cannot set and save your own preset camera angles to move to as and when you want to"

"i spent longer finding the ideal spot in the room than on set up"

"will be returning them to amazon"

"i was very skeptical for the price and didn't expect a lot"

"scrubbing function to access earlier footage is easy to use with section with activity marked out"

"and still unreliable connection!"

"this is a big security issue for me"

"i bought the camera and app so i could monitor my 91 year old mother from 150miles away and it doesn’t work"

"they don't even drop litter in my street now"

"streaming gets delayed often and sound or video switches off randomly"

"i have stopped using it as there are serious security flaws in both the camera and the very basic app"

"it literally screeched very unpleasantly at me when i had my phone in my little girls bedroom!"

"very dissatisfied"

"construction is very solid and it feels bombproof"

"i bought these because there are some local yobs around my area who think it’s funny to throw eggs at my windows"

"the app is pretty awful"

"but having researched and watched graham on dogs behaving very badly"

"if your camera is placed somewhere where privacy is not an issue its a nice piece of kit that works pretty well otherwise i would avoid"

"i haven’t used the cloud storage functionality as i don’t need it but there is a free trial period offered"

"too often many many times a day says that the network speed is slow and so cannot show a live view or recordings although both cameras are wired to a virgin hub2ac"

"when they added that it spent all night "crunching bones" we knew that none of us was willing to spend the night up there and potentially sacrifice ourselves to find out what that something was!"

"and now we reach the reason why spoiler alert i returned the camera for a refund"

"the image quality is ok but given the two main faults i have it cannot be relied upon for reliable surveillance and therefore defeats the point of having it"

"your videos are being hosted by a non uk site that provides minimal information about how it handles your data"

"product description fails to state that cloud storage requires a monthly payment plan and camera continually records rather than just recording when motion is detected"

"i bought this as a baby monitor and the fact it also has night vision but knowing it can be moved without me giving permission is an unsettling factor"

"i like the 2 way audio feature which my old baby monitor doesn't have because sometimes the baby just needs to hear a reassuring voice to help settle back to sleep"

"it would be a 5 star review if it wasn't for the off line issues"

"i didn't want to pay for an expensive product and was worried how this would effect the wuality of the camera it hasnt"

"all of the camera brands appear to have negative reviews but all the problems are the same for whichever camera you buy – i get the impression though that in many cases it is the users poor internet connection and wi fi signal that create these issues"

"we already have a bt 6000 monitor which is upstairs in the babies room but i wanted a cheaper option for her daytime naps in the lounge"

"by the time i got it back out it had been damaged"

"i took a still photo to show my dad he was impressed that i could find him in room even though it was that dark my dad has always been resistant to having a camera as he thought he would be spied on and that it would be intrusive"

"i had intermittent issues with the first camera i purchased when trying to replay video on the sd card as sometimes the video would freeze however i was sent a replacement and this is working fine so far"

"very poorly made camera big gap as seen in photo tried insert my samsung 32gb sd card and it went straight through and dropped inside the camera now i can't retrieve it so lost a memory card inside and i cannot return the camera because of personal data in the card someone would get hold of it!"

"returning soon"

"we used it at first to monitor our poorly kitten but is now relocated to provide security for our house and keep an eye on the rest of our cats"

"even restarting my phone sony xperia less than 6 months old doesn't always work and i am left without the use of the app"

"we purchased this camera as we're planning on going away for a short summer break and didn't want to go all out on a full home security system but still wanted to be able to keep an eye on things"

"good to share between parents both can view at once position negatives: doesn't tilt down as much as i would like to view into a cot from a higher position regular drop offs even in good reception big downside each time it disconnect it loudly says "camera off" and then "camera on" when it reconnects not ideal when you're trying to get your baby to sleep"

"in the process of returning this"

"what i like about the camera: clear picture whether during daylight or night vision clear sound motion detector works with only a couple seconds delay unfortunately i have to give only 1 star as the camera is prone to being faulty"

"to my dismay there was a server error that showed up that did not allow me to access the camera"

"it’s safe to say it’s been unplugged and we will not be using this again"

"wasted my money!"

"too many dodgy issues with this camera"

"if your angle of insertion is slight off the card can easily catch hold of this gap and further pushing of the card will cause it to drop through the gap into the camera missing the actual sd card slot "

"almost £30 for the most useless camera ever and i'm 100% sure that all the reviews are bogus!"

"what i like about the camera: clear picture whether during daylight or night vision clear sound motion detector works with only a couple seconds delay unfortunately i have to give only 1 star as the camera is prone to being faulty"

"the camera after tried the entire week every single days never worked"

"really i can't fault this device"

"probably the only down side is it only looks down about 40 degrees it can look up over 90 degrees though so you may get some issues seeing lower down if the camera is mounted too high"

"returned item"

"the only obvious design flaw is if the camera is stolen then your video is gone"

"absolutely a waste of money no more inconvenience at christmas to send it back"

"i’m on about the alert mode before the new update you can delete this whenever you liked now they just store on the app even when you clear memory card so it’s not full they remain on the app"

"unfortunately faulty"

"we spent around £150 on a baby camera and monitor set up from one of the leading brands being new parents and fairly new to world of wireless cameras we though this was a good deal however after a year it has decide to stop working"

"i have stopped using it as there are serious security flaws in both the camera and the very basic app"

"as it doesn't have a base unit this means the camera is effectively useless unless you plan to put it next to the wifi router not always practical!"

"tried to add this camera to the outside camera software i currently use and it would not work"

"only thing is that the built wifi receiver is not strong enough so we bought a power line adapter and now it’s brilliant connection"

"overall it is a good camera for the price it is really simple to set up and connects well to wi fi the app is good and simple to use i would like the picture to be a little clearer my biggest issue is that my phone seems to need a really good internet connection to connect to camera otherwise i can’t"

"i bought 2 of these to mount in my stables as i have some poorly horses and we need to be able to watch them 24 7 and living in a stables isn't the best of places"

"the wifi funktion does not work"

"very impressed with this little gadget"

"hit the share button asks for a username which i'm told is the email address of the other user nothing happens"

"being a new cat mom i was quite nervous to leave my boys alone for a handful of hours so it was perfect to keep track of them!"

"only disappointment was that the cord was a bit shorter than i would have liked because i wanted to attach the camera to the ceiling which limited me to higher electrical outlets"

"i doubt i can return it now as it is outside the 30 day return window"

"the camera is extremely easy to set up and you should have no problems if you have a strong wifi signal if not hard wiring to the router a reliable broadband internet speed and a phone capable of running the app i am using an ancient iphone 5 otherwise you are likely to experience the problems mentioned in many of the negative reviews of any brand of camera"

"however the item itself is poor disconnects itself and will not reconnect once you go off the app you have to use with it"

"it worked for 1 hour and booom screen went offline i tried resetting and i kept getting error notification"

"awful chinese product"

"the power lead is also very poor quality it is very loose and if you touch it gently it will come out of it's port on the camera so i have to keep are plugging the power lead back in to the camera as it falls out quite often"

"if anyone has any suggestions please fire away otherwise the camera is going to be replaced as its essentially useless for security purposes"

"update: now it’s 11th november since then one of the cameras have fell onto the floor not at a height and it has stopped working cannot pan or move the camera up and down for a different view"

"you can also buy 1 year subscription to 360 app for about £12 a year and get a rolling 30 days of recording storage on the 360 cloud"

"waste of 30 pounds"

"i purposely typed wrong password for wi fi and it immediately made announcement "access point password is wrong""

"nothing worked"

"i bought two after having had a heart attack"

"very big security concerns with this device and after reading some reviews we didn’t see them when we bought it it seems as though multiple people are experiencing the same"

"failed a few times using my phone but when i used my ipad it worked"

"sadly it's not"

"stay far away!"

"i had a motorola camera for our baby its been nothing but a pain since i bought it: continual video dropouts and poor pan zoom"

"the 2 way voice is clearly audible too but there is a small delay but nothing unacceptable"

"you only get notification messages and if used for monitoring wandering risks for confused elderly it's insufficient"

"i did use the two way communication my dog heard me but to be honest it made her worse as she then tried to climb up and eat the camera"

"when compared to my pi zero with camera this really looks poor"

"thought this was ok at first till i bought another brand elsewhere its poor quality rubbish app as its hard to view reports accurately and the sound quality when trying to hear whats going on is a waste of time"

"i do like this home security camera i use this for my dog when at home alone and whilst working through his separation issues"

"also there's a card that comes with the cam promoting some free sd card and camera peripherals"

"these things are too risky to be used indoors or where children are concerned"

"i have been really impressed by the camera easy to set up good images night vision etc but the app constantly freezes and or produces the message 'unable to contact server'"

"great concept but unreliable unit"

"update:::: it then fell off my low table"

"when the cloud storage month runs out you can install a sd card to store the video but i do not know whether you are able to check the video when logging into the app to do this"

"this malware is widely used in ddos attacks and cannot be removed from the camera"

"the app is the biggest failing of this product it keeps freezing"

"i wasn’t expecting too much for the money but i’m blown away with the quality for one but ease of setup straight out of the box and download the app for my phone and ipad and i was all set to be able to keep an eye on my new puppy from my own bed i could even talk to him to calm him down when he started crying!"

"our baby monitor recently gave up the ghost and we were looking for something cheap and cheerful to fill the gap until we didn’t need to keep an eye on him anymore"

"if you have the latest sky q which is 5ghz this camera will not work"

"from taking this camera out of the box to actually using it took no time at all in fact actually downloading the app took the longest"

"the problem is the camera can't pick up the wifi signal we have superfast bt broadband so not a cheap provider in a room that is probably less that 10 feet in a straight line from the router"

"also had faulty one and company replaced with issue"

"we used it at first to monitor our poorly kitten but is now relocated to provide security for our house and keep an eye on the rest of our cats"

"waste of time and money"

"if there are any buyers wishing to buy this but perhaps have some questions first it is probably worth asking in the question & answer section because i am sure any question can be answered on this little delight!"

"our elder dog has recently had an op’ to remove a tumour"

"configuration failed each time"

"i did and this one does work with virgin media superhub"

"i bought this to keep an eye on my dog while out and it works but barely it has to be plugged into your moderm unless you have a very old wifi the app is awful and constantly tries to trick you into buying a subscription and crashes constantly while using"

"i was so relieved that we weren’t on holiday as we had planned"

"tried to add this camera to the outside camera software i currently use and it would not work"

"the camera seems to tilt more higher than lower"

"it also needed to work from a usb cable as the coop is powered by a solar panel this limited my search somewhat"

"4 wireless which makes it useless in europe"

"just don't expect to be able to see outside through windows at night as the night vision lights reflect off the window so the picture isn't great then picture is fine in the day just as good as our much more expensive cctv system"

"i was hesitant at getting one that links through a phone purely cause i dont like my phone being on all night long"

"terrible product touch the camera and disconnects from your phone and needs deleting and resetting only connects 1 in 100 attempts even when following all the instructions and ensuring it’s on the correct band width of wifi all in all a terrible product!"

"and the phone app you need to run it is simple to follow as well although you get full instructions in the accompanying manual too which helps "

"ios app is clunky and push notifications when motion is detected seem to only work sometimes"

"you can’t skip small increments as it seems to jump in 10min blocks so again you have to watch footage in real time if not captured by the motion detection feature"

"the laugh is the victure camera is not designed to be an exterior solution however it's non aggressive looking design makes it look more like a friendly robot compared to your usual exterior cctv camera"

"so i have stood the pc530 in front of the screen that i view my old cameras on and point it at the screen and can now view my old cameras via this new one on my mobile phone as an additional bonus i can now pan around the room and check on my dogs when we are out if we are ever allowed out that is!"

"doesn’t feel cheap of flimsy"

"doesn't even record when only set to detect movements"

"4hz wireless band which screwed up my router's settings and made all devices at home congested and slow"

"the video files are encrypted and you only seem to be able to watch them on the app on your phone which is really really badly designed"

"when the device came up in a lightning deal i thought it was a good time to give it a whirl especially as the reviews looked largely positive"

"would like the monitor to be less bright and less volume & would like to see a two way microphone on it so you can talk into the monitor & the sound comes out of the camera"

"i took a still photo to show my dad he was impressed that i could find him in room even though it was that dark my dad has always been resistant to having a camera as he thought he would be spied on and that it would be intrusive"

"firstly the negative points:"

"i'd avoid this model"

"despite continued attempts at resetting the unit i eventually decided the unit could not be relied upon"

"as soon as your phone screen goes off it's stops working"

"if you are purchasing this camera for security only – i still feel it is worth purchasing this camera"

"i tried various combinations but no response from the app just does a dumb screen refresh"

"alternatively you can swipe on the live picture for it to go where you want it to"

"i am impressed by this little product for our new baby although i have had problems getting the two way speaker to work and also the night vision seems to stay on even if you have the light on in the room other than that can’t complain for the money"

"there was fault in my room and i used the planon app the report the issue to given a email that it was done but while i was passed out asleep in my room"

"i have a good broadband connection and even hard wired it when i thought maybe its just not any good for wireless connection but the picture quality is very poor definitely no where near 1080p and extremely choppy glitchy"

"sound is what you would expect from a small speaker not great but not too bad either"

"unless you have your phone too close to it it then sounds extremely distorted and i mean even just in the same room as it"

"the app is broken crashes every 2 minutes or so you can't use it as a baby monitor"

"good thing is camera is audio playback for any error occurs during configuration so easy to debug"

"first impressions were positive setup was relatively easy the picture quality was at least reasonable and the iphone app whilst not perhaps the most stylish you could hope for seemed to control the camera well over a network in my short tests"

"i have the event cloud storage for 30 days on subscription however it doesn't save 30 days it misses the majority of events mixes them on the time line and time stamps are completely inaccurate"

"but this one failed to perform the night vision is awful motion dection was naff and picture quality even in the day was bad"

"update stopped working properly after 6 months no way of getting refund"

"the camera starts talking to the phone app but then just stops and i receive the configure failed"

"the description does not mention this additional expense for the buyer and should be flagged up as mis selling"

"to install the app you need to disable security settings"

"even tried to connect directly via cable but kept saying ‘no camera detected"

"most of the time you doesn’t know you are 5 minutos delayed and sound is not working"

"i use my camera for indoor activity just incase i get broken into but you could use this camera for multiple things"

"what i like about the camera: clear picture whether during daylight or night vision clear sound motion detector works with only a couple seconds delay unfortunately i have to give only 1 star as the camera is prone to being faulty"

"it does make a clicking sound when the ir turns on and off but again doesn't really bother me but you can hear it when the light gets low it will turn on and off until it gets dark enough for it to be on permanently"

"too often many many times a day says that the network speed is slow and so cannot show a live view or recordings although both cameras are wired to a virgin hub2ac"

"nothing else to say except refund via amazon went smooth as always"

"there is also a cloud storage option you pay a subscription for as a alternative so it would make sense why my sd card would end up corrupted"

"tried about 5 times and just heard this weird noise"

"this isn't true in the slightest they just generally moan"

"this means it is poor for night time use"

"i suppose there is a chance that my one was broken but seems others have similar issues"

"the victure has not dropped connection or let me down to date"

"it always notifies me correctly when somebody is there and captures the footage however i would say that the amount of footage that it captures is sometimes too short"

"the poor video quality is the trade off for a simple reliable easy to access product"

"i have plain bb so no concerns with 5g non compatibility"

"app needs a little work as there is no way to fast forward through saved videos and it tends use too much battery power"

"not well made and poor product"

"for the purposes we need it for all it's missing is the treat dispensing option that furbos have which isn't a big deal for us"

"the power lead is also very poor quality it is very loose and if you touch it gently it will come out of it's port on the camera so i have to keep are plugging the power lead back in to the camera as it falls out quite often"

"you can refuse and get past this but why does the developer want to know where you are so badly?"

"so anyone else who is having neighbourhood issues this is definitely the camera to buy if you want clear images and videos"

"we don't believe it's the wifi don't have any issues with our ring doorbell "

"the motion detection barely works"

"i have fitted sd card into the unit but not watched anything back on that as of yet"

"i have to give the seller 5 out of 5 for customer service they made the effort to get in touch and resolve my issues and replace the faulty camera for an improved model what a difference the image is outstanding i wish others would take a leaf out of this manufactures effort thank you!"

"it can not find the device"

"lots of work to be done on the app is desperately needed as without it the camera is useless"

"product is faulty"

"probably the only down side is it only looks down about 40 degrees it can look up over 90 degrees though so you may get some issues seeing lower down if the camera is mounted too high"

"no sd slot icloud recording for a couple of weeks which then stopped now expected to pay extortionate icloud rental now has gone offline and won’t go back online"

"i've had other ip cameras before but they always end up being a bit unreliable"

"the app you download is not great either clunky and non responsive most of the time"

"their app is woeful and laggy"

"i had to put it on my guest wifi which you can only have with an expensive router or an access point"

"the next day i moved the camera to a different room and the card no longer worked or was even recognised by pc and laptop when attempting to format"

"it should be collected with no printer required"

"i can't believe what you get for such a low price"

"pan the room at a swipe of a finger"

"an app on both of our phones could let us check in to the dogs at any stage the voice option on it was great for deterring the puppy from eating the sofa!"

"there was a small problem at first and i almost sent it back but then i realised the problem was caused by me"

"most of the time you doesn’t know you are 5 minutos delayed and sound is not working"

"the night vision was good but only gave it 4 stars because of local light pollution"

"my son has recently told me that the camera talks that it scared him and it's said bad words and the word 'pants'"

"the email apologised for the "late response" and pointed me in the direction of removing the camera and then adding it but this time marking the location as the uk which it was originally set to"

"they don't have a massive long cable and we had to buy an extension for one so that we could position it upside down on the ceiling in one room but that's no big deal"

"the motion detection on the camera is a complete waste of time and will just alert you every couple of minutes even when there is absolutely nothing there so i had this disabled the whole time i owned the camera which is a really big disadvantage!"

"i don't know how it would work in total darkness but for me it's fine"

"the only gripe i can think of is the thickness off the camera connections especially the internet one"

"initial setup is a little complicated but if you follow the instructions carefully then it works the only issue being that the cameras need a 2"

"honestly can't fault this especially as we got it when it was on offer"

"once up the camera is easy to set up with the downloadable app qr code supplied and the images are as good as i have seen on some more expensive cameras"

"i put an sd card into it which it quickly used the memory on you should be able to clear the card from the app but that doesn’t seem to work it gives an error message every time"

"the only problem i had was that i had to position the camera very close to the router as the camera kept dropping out even though the wifi signal showed 57% and that this was a good signal"

"only minor issue found so far is that one sd card of two wouldn't 'mount' meaning it required manually reformatting on my pc but was soon sorted and have had no further issues with it"

"when it's sunny and cloud cover comes across again it false alarms"

"i've got a major problem trying to figure out how to house these cables"

"we also pay around £1 a month so we continue to receive video recorded notifications after the free trial ends a tiny amount for piece of mind "

"this is the first issue"

"my only negative is that it is quite big and obvious on the front of the house"

"only minor issue found so far is that one sd card of two wouldn't 'mount' meaning it required manually reformatting on my pc but was soon sorted and have had no further issues with it"

"i took another reviewers suggestion of putting all of the wires in a junction box outside as the cables are too bulky as a group to easily put through the wall so i just put the power cable through"

"feel free to waste your money you really would be better getting a wired unit with a centrally controlled hard drive all at home as that will run for years with no issues"

"i have had cctv systems before that were far more expensive and was a little dubious about a camera at such a cheap price and thought that the quality would not be that good"

"two way communication does work but has slight delay inevitable i guess "

"one slight negative is that the mounting screws provided were of a very poor quality"

"also to subscribe to the motion data as the camera doesn't always get a photo of the trigger but will record it!"

"i am just very disappointed i cannot return the other camera or even request a refund as i have no power adapter to set up the second camera which is now left redundant"

"i thought the microphone and speaker were going to be a waste of time but i can clearly hear anyone talking at my front door"

"the people with wifi issues either don't know what they are doing or have crap routers"

"it’s just incredibly frustrating"

"there is a time delay when watching on my phone but that is to be expected with all devices of this type"

"as soon as they do this i will be buying!"

"you would either have to get a memory card to record continuous but then in the event of it being stolen you have list all the footage or pay £8 a month for 24 7 recording to the cloud"

"the camera itself isn't bad by any means and especially for £40 however the biggest fault i have with it is the connection and even though i have a wifi extender literally less than 4 metres away from the camera really the connection is still garbage half the time it says the camera isn't on which is rubbish because i know it's on it's just the connection is so terrible"

"i still need to play with the settings much more to get it all right as i am getting alerts for every drop of rain that falls at the moment and that’s on the lowest sensitivity setting"

"i like that you can add a micro sd card in and it will record everything for you but setting these up can be tideious and frustrating"

"after lengthy and unsuccessful attempts to contact the company direct located in china with no apparent uk agent i was informed robotically via e mail chat that it only worked at 2"

"the only reason i give this 4 stars is because of the storage issue with multiple devices not being available"

"but it is not designed to be a high end 8 mega pixel camera with all the transmission and storage issues that you would come up against"

"the camera body is ok mostly plastic so will either fall apart or last until the next millennium"

"so we have power it's a standard dc connector and massive extension cables are cheaply available through amazon lan with an indicator led built in again a 25m run is easily purchased but even longer can be made cheaply and thirdly a weatherproof wifi reset button: i default away from wifi but recognise the brilliant innovation this option is just try getting up a ladder and removing the access plate to locate a tiny black button inside the body of the unit "

"i got so fed up with various things going wrong such as the picture freezing that i thought i’ll sort it out tomorrow"

"using ethernet wired connection was not a major issue"

"i had issues setting up wifi connection but it turned out to be user error my end"

"setting up the wifi so as to use without the rj45 cable was my main gripe"

"months on still regular problems when it should just work it's unreliable bottom line in a product where reliability is critical we had an issue with car break inns and low and behold despite paying for the 24 7 service"

"seems good value for money but the costs to subscribe to cloud services are not clear at the outset so i guess the low product price is balanced with the annual fees to subscribe"

"not everybody realises you can make 3 or 4 adjacent holes to create a larger one it leaves me thankful that we share a world with folk like that because it means i still have a job"

"i thought the picture quality would be rubbish but it's really not"

"get the awful feeling that its spying on us"

"had this arrive today after looking around alot i found this on offer with an added amazon discount code it didnt work out to be cheapest but looked to be best value anyway when it arrived i opened it up and theres everything you need besides a drill and screwdriver to fit it actually included the corrected masonry drill bit for the plugs anyway about 10mins later it was installed setting up was very simple"

"even though i set it up with just one square area of motion detection it still picks up loud noises when cars go past"

"and some cameras do lose connection sometimes"

"i am just very disappointed i cannot return the other camera or even request a refund as i have no power adapter to set up the second camera which is now left redundant"

"the camera is ultimately a wi fi camera but there are three annoying wires which you can't easily hide"

"there are video tutorials if your unsure as you setup"

"slight issue with the large network cable as i had to drill a very large hole to get this mounted to the wall so that no cables were showing"

"this made installation harder than need be as the screw heads are so soft they stripped immediately"

"i have had several problems since and sadly they were all caused by me!"

"cloud storage lasts for a 14 day trial then it is a very expensive subscription per camera"

"it becomes expensive at $70 per year per camera"

"obviously the only way you know the camera isnt connected to tour router is when you open the netvue app"

"the instructions which come with it are easy to follow but unfortunately only tell you about installing it & nothing about using it but i found this information on the web"

"we have a particularly awkward outdoor view and cannot see the gate or visitors without going outdoors and round the corner so i decided to be brave and try an outdoor camera although it did seem a bit sci fi and hi tech for our rather basic household"

"only let down is the motion detection it doesn't pick my 6ft frame up but does trigger with flies"

"it takes a lot to impress me and get a security device put into my smart home and this camera has ended a long painful search"

"i’ve only just found a busy electrician to fit my camera"

"i had some trouble connecting these cameras to my wi fi at 1st"

"so we had a spate of tyre damages to cars outside the house so decided to get a good quality night vision camera to use as a deterrent to further problems"

"i have positioned my camera to cover my front garden so i don't want false triggers from the road outside it was very simple to disable the image zones where i don't want a notification then the sensitivity was adjusted with a simple slider"

"so unless you mount the camera under an overhang which shelters the camera from rain or snow then you are going to get a lot of false alerts"

"easy enough to install but i’ve had constant problems with the cameras stopping functioning when the cards fills up you get no alert this has happened even though it’s supposed to reformat automatically"

"having a built in speaker on the camera is just a bit of fun so far"

"the device is up to date and never gets unplugged"

"one slight negative is that the mounting screws provided were of a very poor quality"

"disgusting support!"

"downsides motion detection sensitivity in app is not great app could have better features but not the worst either no option to view on laptop pc the drill bit that came with it was really poor quality that broke in less then 10 seconds of using"

"you tighten up some grub screws after adjustment which holds the camera rock solid so there are no false motion detections due to camera wobble "

"i do understand that expecting the wifi to go through two outdoor brick walls is a big ask"

"looks like i was given a returned damaged item"

"i have been a long time user of another brand of wifi camera but kept having connection issues so i though i would give netvue a go prompted by other reviews and there very competitive price"

"this is my second netvue product after purchasing an indoor camera for our babies nursery and this product is just as if not more impressive"

"there is a delay in the live view on the echo comared to the app on galaxy note"

"as there have been a few dubious people around decided on this vigil camera to keep a check out"

"the motion detection issue is now with their research team and i am confident that they will come up with a solution to the sensitivity issue very quickly"

"our postman had a right scare when we suddenly spoke out from it"

"i wish the motion detection had daily settings for when its active and a greater number of squares to get a more defined area"

"after a while i worked out that the wireless mesh network in my house was a little adva ced for the wifi card in the camera"

"the second and more bothersome is that when i tried to access the sd files in my computer i figured that the video files are in a proprietary format!"

"installation outdoors was pretty easy and took a few small adjustments to get the perfect picture"

"firstly the power wire is woefully short limiting placement unless you add in extension cables"

"everything needed seems to be in the box even down to a masonary drill if you were mounting against brick"

"i bought 2 of these cameras for my mum as she has had some unwelcome visitors looking around her property recently needless to say she hasn't received any problems since!"

"camera feels sturdy and solid has a built in mic to capture sound and also a speaker so you could even scare off unwanted visitors by talking into the app!"

"i would suggest that you carry most of step 4 with the included parts to weatherproof the ethernet connector unless i missed something "

"it was equally easy to pair it with alexa but the results are less satisfactory"

"my only quibble is that the aerial joint is not sufficiently stiff and the aerial flops around rather than standing upright"

"sound from the camera speaker is also good but useless for me as i have mounted the camera too high and cant hear it from the floor"

"installation to its location was easy and i only needed to use a small drill hole to feed the supplied power cable into an outdoor cable box where the power connection together with wifi and ethernet cable not being used in wifi set up and the camera was easily fitted into location a template was provided but i didn't use this"

"finally it’s not value for money and the motion detection when alerting gives a blank error which cannot be seen what it’s picked up"

"i will be buying a second camera 👍🏻 update after a few months: i left my previous review after the first week or so of having the camera after being bribed by netvue with 3 months free subscription to motion detection alerts"

"so this feature got turned off which is one of the reasons i wanted the camera it would notify that there was motion at my door i would ask alexa to show me the front door cam to see who it was then answer the door the whole process was to hit and miss and just takes too long by the time the video comes up the person would have left thinking there is nobody at home"

"the only shortcoming is the software which is limited for retrieving photos and videos from the sd card"

"slight issue with the large network cable as i had to drill a very large hole to get this mounted to the wall so that no cables were showing"

"the night vision is not very good but you still see so for me it’s awesome"

"having read previous reviews i thought very carefully about where i should position it to avoid a difficult installation"

"although a budget buy this camera does everything much more expensive cameras do and netvue appears responsive to customers in developing and improving its software"

"not normaly one who writes reviews however having purchased a number of alleged good external cameras all of which never came up to scratch as reviewed or advertised"

"don't waste your time"

"the camera does drop out of wifi so at times i cant see it on my phone but i've found that this doesn't mean it isn't working as the camera continues to record to the sd card when not connected to wifi so nothing is missed"

"it's younger sibling killed by the same update is going back on an amazon doa return"

"will definitely be buying netvue again if we need more"

"the support from netvue has recently been diabolical"

"i have used indoors netvue and they are great but i did not expect to be amazed by the quality of the outdoors one too"

"there’s also no web interface and support is definitely lacking"

"by comparison the cheap camera that i replaced kept buffering and losing connection constantly"

"a real shame because when they first worked they were brilliant but they’ve clearly done something to the firmware that doesn’t play nice now"

"difficult to setup as it only works with 2"

"when this trial add on was removed from software the camera was completely disabled and had to return"

"best of all the power supply requirements are the same as my analogue system so they literally took minutes to swap over"

"but saying that think it would be the same or worse on any other camera"

"the picture quality with these is much better and i actually see the fact they don't record to a central box as a bonus no more hard drive failures!"

"i have had cctv systems before that were far more expensive and was a little dubious about a camera at such a cheap price and thought that the quality would not be that good"

"i have had a few videos which were unable to upload"

"and when it works it randomly goes into buffering every so often"

"have tried adjusting the sensitivity but can't get it to work properly but for a camera of this price i can't complain too much"

"as i had already purchased a netvue wi fi doorbell and been very pleased with it buying the netvue vigil camera s was an obvious next step as they offer sd card recording and playback capability without needing to purchase cloud based storage it’s just a case of mounting the units out of easy reach"

"the following reasons why i could not give it 5 stars: the speaker on the camera is very low level and even though it is installed just above head height you cannot be heard very clearly"

"bought this camera as i have a bad neighbour next to me who keeps damaging my property"

"i still need to play with the settings much more to get it all right as i am getting alerts for every drop of rain that falls at the moment and that’s on the lowest sensitivity setting"

"one subscription should cover more cameras not just one otherwise it gets too expensive"

"at night the problem was the opposite initially there was no motion detection as soon as it was dark although after a couple of weeks of emails back and forth to support they sent through new firmware which resolved this problem"

"which it really shouldn't be to be honest if i could be bothered to take the camera down and send it back i would but i really cant as it was a bit of a task getting it up"

"one thing i would like to say is that it would be nice to have a sealing plug if you are not going to hard wire the broadband side and just use the wifi as it leaves a tiny hole in the cable enterance"

"cover the camera in lens in something i taped a sock around it disconnect the end with the three mounting holes using the hex key provided hold the mount against the wall and drill three smaller holes with a 4mm drill bit take the mount away and open the holes up to fit the rawlplugs"

"you could fit a connection box outside instead of running cable through the wall"

"motion sensor is temperamental wont record our car parking pretty large subject image but will record endless hours of rain"

"the second and more bothersome is that when i tried to access the sd files in my computer i figured that the video files are in a proprietary format!"

"if you need a cost effective way to monitor your home minimal affect on the wifi check from anywhere and has a speaker for interactions with home for example asking someone to leave a parcel somewhere safe "

"installation is not straightforward because you will need a very large hole in wall to pass cable assembly through"

"my only quibble is that the aerial joint is not sufficiently stiff and the aerial flops around rather than standing upright"

"two minor issues though"

"i’ve recently bought several of these netvue 1080p outdoor security cameras as my existing ones from another maker were very unreliable and constantly dropped their wi fi connections"

"as soon as is possible this useless ornament will be taken down and replaced with something that actually works!"

"i got the outdoor camera because a number of dogs have gone missing out of peoples gardens and as my house has a dirt road at the side i’m always nervous that one of my fur babies might get stolen"

"already used footage for an incident i did have a problem where just after the time the firmware updates the camera failed i opened a chat at 8am and gave the problem to customer services who passed to technical services who by 9"

"i tried live chat and didn't get anywhere"

"have attached photo in this review"

"night vision is as about as good as ir can get and at this price point it's extremely hard to beat"

"you have to download a small player they made i found in netvue forum and it's awful!"

"killed by the update "

"i'm using a 128gb micro sd card playback is of a high quality and unbroken"

"i’m not using cloud but i am using the sd card the card formats while installed and for a couple of days i’m able to use the camera fine and watch back recordings but then i’m not able to view recordings unless i join cloud for a fee of course"

"for the price paid the camera is excellent i did look around and all the other camera's where more expensive so far i am very pleased the camera picture day or night is excellent and the piece of mind i get from seeing what is going on around my property is great i do live in a very remote area and therefore no traffic passes my house just the occasional rambler"

"cover the camera in lens in something i taped a sock around it disconnect the end with the three mounting holes using the hex key provided hold the mount against the wall and drill three smaller holes with a 4mm drill bit take the mount away and open the holes up to fit the rawlplugs"

"only issue advice is so mount it too high as the spiders are always making webs on the camera and this also can trigger off motion alerts if u have this set up"

"only issue advice is so mount it too high as the spiders are always making webs on the camera and this also can trigger off motion alerts if u have this set up"

"it does work without the cloud subscription but motion detection is rubbish all the time"

"the camera itself isn't bad by any means and especially for £40 however the biggest fault i have with it is the connection and even though i have a wifi extender literally less than 4 metres away from the camera really the connection is still garbage half the time it says the camera isn't on which is rubbish because i know it's on it's just the connection is so terrible"

"my only quibble is that the aerial joint is not sufficiently stiff and the aerial flops around rather than standing upright"

"by comparison the cheap camera that i replaced kept buffering and losing connection constantly"

"the unit showed a solid green light so apparently all connected but the app said the camera is offline"

"but it is not designed to be a high end 8 mega pixel camera with all the transmission and storage issues that you would come up against"

"but the delay is so long"

"cannot fault this bullet cam"

"after a stream of emails to support i am now returning my dead original unit"

"for the price of this camera i would not hesitate to recommend it"

"i guess most of the time the video comes up but sometimes it times out trying to connect"

"i have had cctv systems before that were far more expensive and was a little dubious about a camera at such a cheap price and thought that the quality would not be that good"

"this really is just a case of trial and error and the app offers sensitivity adjustments so you can have it exactly as you want it"

"however there is no way to stop recording except by pulling out the power plug which seems a bit brutal the app should provide for this to prevent file corruption i did try disconnecting power the sd card seemed ok and successfully re mounted on restoring power"

"my only quibble it that the camera is not poe"

"are equally good in many ways but don't record continously"

"unfortunately even after 2 months i didn't receive the free 64gb sd card as mentioned in the package i received after claiming even no reply to my 2 emails"

"compact camera but as this model has an ethernet plug on it you have to drill at least a 12mm hole to get the cable through the wall lots of teething problems but the online chat is instant and they always seem to fix the issues but i'd rather it just ran seamlessly than have any pro lems like dropped signal etc or a tf card that has worked perfectly well in the camera for 2 weeks suddenly is no longer recognised"

"well i've now set it up outside and had tried it on wi fi and on internet cable also as i have a fire stick and alex's i did link it to there account on a good note it works well with the app on a good but bad point as i did not adjust my settings but turned on motion detection it was cool for the first"

"i have unfortunately ended up with a lan connection to my router but as i said earlier this may be my internet supplier issues"

"a real shame because when they first worked they were brilliant but they’ve clearly done something to the firmware that doesn’t play nice now"

"however there is no way to stop recording except by pulling out the power plug which seems a bit brutal the app should provide for this to prevent file corruption i did try disconnecting power the sd card seemed ok and successfully re mounted on restoring power"

"months on still regular problems when it should just work it's unreliable bottom line in a product where reliability is critical we had an issue with car break inns and low and behold despite paying for the 24 7 service"

"one criticism would be the leads should be detachable to get through smaller holes"

"4ghz not 5ghz"

"well i've now set it up outside and had tried it on wi fi and on internet cable also as i have a fire stick and alex's i did link it to there account on a good note it works well with the app on a good but bad point as i did not adjust my settings but turned on motion detection it was cool for the first"

"every day i contact nevue to be told that their “engineers are working on a fix” but that’s been four days now with no progress so i’m sending these back for a refund"

"an sd card not included is required to store images video including motion detection although a paid cloud service is available"

"the motion detection issue is now with their research team and i am confident that they will come up with a solution to the sensitivity issue very quickly"

"but i went to my hubs user login on internet explorer and turned the 5g off so it could connect to the 2"

"had to go through the process twice but it didn’t take long"

"to get footage you need to get a ladder and climb the ladder to the camera unscrew it all to get to the memory card take the memory out put it into your pc get the footage you need then go back up the ladder put the memory card back in screw all the camera back together and as your doing all this your"

"however there is no way to stop recording except by pulling out the power plug which seems a bit brutal the app should provide for this to prevent file corruption i did try disconnecting power the sd card seemed ok and successfully re mounted on restoring power"

"can't really go wrong for the price"

"i recently brought the homecam indoor secuirty cam from the same seller last month and had a few problems with it and these got resolved really well and rapidly because of this i decided to buy a new camera for the outside secuirty of my house"

"my only real criticism is that i would like more control over scheduling the motion detection and they do not work with iftt"

"i was looking for a easy install camera for a while now that would not brake the bank and then my friend showed me the netvue he has i was shocked when he told me how much he payed and all the features the camera qualty is amzing with the movement notafication sent to your phone so you know where ever"

"compact camera but as this model has an ethernet plug on it you have to drill at least a 12mm hole to get the cable through the wall lots of teething problems but the online chat is instant and they always seem to fix the issues but i'd rather it just ran seamlessly than have any pro lems like dropped signal etc or a tf card that has worked perfectly well in the camera for 2 weeks suddenly is no longer recognised"

"you can view the cameras live without signing up to any storage or buying an sd card from the app but you wont be able to record the footage so bare this in mind"

"i wanted this to monitor our back garden as we've had some items "removed" recently and i am delighted with how easy it was to setup and use"

"if the 12v power cord is cut then that's the end of your camera security as there is no battery back up"

"when linking accounts to amazon it would return a load of code and would not link"

"having being a victim of crime and searching the internet for a good but reasonably priced outdoor camera i can honesty say i am pleased with this product"

"bought this camera as i have a bad neighbour next to me who keeps damaging my property"

"so we had a spate of tyre damages to cars outside the house so decided to get a good quality night vision camera to use as a deterrent to further problems"

"what i did not like about it was the setup"

"but now the camera is pointless constantly showing off line constantly needing to format the sd card do not buy this camera!"

"so long as your cameras will be close to your router then it should be fine"

"i had some doing work in my garage while i was away in another country and i was able to view and speak clearly with the"

"the camera whilst working was a fairly good product for the price paid the problem & the reason of the low rating is due to the customer support while the support for set up alone was good the issue with support for returning a faulty unit is a complete nightmare"

"no instructions with the camera at all but good website and it appears they have good customer service but i haven't needed it yet!"

"the only slight frustration is that there is large bunch of cables out of the camera body which are redundant if you are using as a wireless device"

"i was sceptical of the signal and thought i'd have issues with the wifi signal dropping out"

"no matter which ever way i tried it would just not stay connected"

"what i did find good that the camera came with all screws wall plugs a masonry drill bit and a hex key to adjust the direction of the camera"

"however there is no way to stop recording except by pulling out the power plug which seems a bit brutal the app should provide for this to prevent file corruption i did try disconnecting power the sd card seemed ok and successfully re mounted on restoring power"

"only hicup is with the alexa app i could not get it to add the skill but when i logged in via netvue on the computer and logged in via a password password reset and not facebook it logged it in and now all working"

"has motion sensor in the app to alert you of movement and captures a screenshot each time in the app no subscripton charge required for this "

"live view works fine which makes it even more disappointing"

"i thought the picture quality would be rubbish but it's really not"

"not sure on cloud and motion upgrade costs as seems a bit excessive but haven’t looked in to this yet"

"you can however scroll back in time and record for whatever period you want as long as you do it before it is overwritten"

"i'm not using motion detection yet because i wanted this primarily to be able to see who is at the front door so i cannot comment on that"

"whatever had blocked the camera reporting in was fixed by the reboot and the camera went live it was also a lot more responsive through the app so my router was the problem here"

"cloud service don’t work as described gives me 100+ notifications that my cat is running around but can’t detect no humans see pictures no marker for humans"

"get in seconds a warning on my iphone and can see what is happening"

"good product and no need for expensive subscriptions either :"

"so this feature got turned off which is one of the reasons i wanted the camera it would notify that there was motion at my door i would ask alexa to show me the front door cam to see who it was then answer the door the whole process was to hit and miss and just takes too long by the time the video comes up the person would have left thinking there is nobody at home"

"only hicup is with the alexa app i could not get it to add the skill but when i logged in via netvue on the computer and logged in via a password password reset and not facebook it logged it in and now all working"

"i don't need the ethernet option but would be useful to those with weak wifi signal great addition!"

"without the costly addons the camera is rubbish in my opinion"

"u still get motion alerts while not subscribing"

"you can zoom into the image on te phone app but the resolution falls off pretty fast as this is only 1080"

"not good not good at all"

"first problem: it seems that each video file is 10 minutes long but there are some space between them some seconds that don't get recorded at all"

"i was delighted after i replaced a defective similar unit from another brand because this device behaved exactly as advertised"

"using the app each stage of the set up is clearly explained and supported by a short demonstration video"

"my only issue is the three cables hanging out of the back of it makes it a little more difficult to install"

"you tighten up some grub screws after adjustment which holds the camera rock solid so there are no false motion detections due to camera wobble "

"i really wanted it to film across my whole driveway but that's more down to me putting the camera in the wrong place"

"connecting to router bt hub was a little frustrating but i expected that as bt is dual banded"

"it has been having trouble loading the live feed but i sure it is a blip and am going to contact customer support if the problem persists"

"pretty easy to set up and worked well for a couple of weeks and then following a firmware update the cameras have been completely useless"

"camera isn't perfect though and a few things could be better might even be the app and not the camera to be honest"

"i made the mistake of cutting the network plug off to help feed the wire through thinking i wouldn't need it as i was using wireless"

"have tried contacting their customer service but received no reply so will try and get a refund somehow"

"actual time attaching camera and cables was minutes only"

"easily hear the birds from back of the house"

"as to the camera once initial issues sorted probably due wifi dropping off without me knowing it is excellent"

"bit of a con showing the camera fitted flush against the wall with no wires showing"

"so therefore i returned it"

"i don't often write reviews but i am quite impressed with this camera"

"i got this one for my back way as there have been some crimes in some other back ways so just like the fact its keeping a eye on my home while i go to work pros easy to set up and helpful app cons just can cut out some times for no reson and picture can be a bit hard to see sometimes but that could be times of the day would get other one for my front way aswell"

"i did have one fail on me recently after 6 months"

"cons: large holes required for installation"

"4ghz wireless not a 5"

"support says that 128gb cards no longer work"

"it is the ethernet socket that determins the size!"

"quite why they didn't do this in the first place i will never know"

"showing 97% signal in the app with no buffering"

"despite what anyone says it will not necessarily be easy to fit"

"4ghz if you don't do this it may be difficult to connect you can switch 5ghz back on after its connected"

"picked up car headlights even though in “blocked” area"

"i've been searching a long time for home security camera's with two way audio to replace my outside ip camera's that don't have audio"

"but cloud storage solves this issue"

"our postman had a right scare when we suddenly spoke out from it"

"at night in ir in rainy day is prone to false positives detects rain drops or snow flakes practically useless so i switched off infra red and rely on pir lamp to detect motion outdoor"

"without the costly addons the camera is rubbish in my opinion"

"you can view anywhere not just when you are on the same local network"

"lots of choices in settings i haven't explored yet"

"this bullet style camera is approx £75 cheaper than my hikvision!"

"please don’t change "

"set up on these cameras couldn't be easier"

"however using the camera to monitor outside motion is hit and miss and certainly not effective with the infra red camera as the light reflects off the windows at night"

"it is beyond frustrating especially when something has been stolen off your driveway which has happened this morning only to find nothing was recorded!"

"even a drill bit for drilling the holes for mounting the camera"

"another desireable feature of the netvue software is that it allows ‘sharing’ this enables me to share all the camera features with my wife and as such she also can manage the settings and receive notifications from the motion alarm"

"i’d like to connect this to my own nas drive or eyespy software but ip address access is not allowed"

"4ghz was better did have trouble connecting to a wifi extender did away with that so eliminated the problem"

"the camera connection has 3 quite bulky wires which would need a really big hole to bring inside"

"this means you only have to drill a small hole through the wall for the power cable and into the back of the junction box"

"at first these seem great but as time wears on they become more and more unreliable"

"as it wasn't connecting for me they sent a solution to get an update through but still wasn't working"